Posted by Hemant Mehta in I can’t believe this sort of thing still goes on in this day and age.
The best description I can find of the video below says: five people suspected of witchcraft were brutally murdered — burned alive — in Nyamataro, a village in Kisii, Kenya.
The victims are the elderly (over 80) and four of the five are women.
You can see victims trying to get out of the ditch only to be pushed back in. Some victims are just kicked around. Others are beaten with a stick.
It’s the worst of human nature. To paraphrase Voltaire, when people believe absurdities, they can commit atrocities. This is a perfect example.
It’s senseless murder. Rational people know these victims are not witches capable of inflicting curses or anything of the sort.
It’s definitely graphic and NSFW. Don’t watch it if you get queasy easily:
I’m completely stunned and saddened.
I didn’t watch it because I get queasy easily; I didn’t watch it because I get angry easily. I get angry at extremely stupid activities performed by idiotlogical dogmatists.
I won’t watch the video, I don’t need to see the violence to be offended by it.
In a similar vein, there was an item on a current affairs program last night about albinos being maimed and murdered in Africa to get their body parts to perform magic with. They mentioned how people would grab an albino child and just hack a limb off.
You have to wonder how people could do such things!
I couldn’t finish it.
People who say that the Bible is a perfect book should have to watch that.
Just sick and sad – why was it filmed i wonder?
It’s one of the most horrific things I’ve ever seen, especially the cruelty or indifference of the bystanders. Those poor people.
That this happens at all is hard to accept. That it should happen in the 21st century and for witchcraft, frigging witchcraft is almost inconceivable.
Another reminder that the civility and rationality we see around us is a fragile thing.
I didn’t get past 30 seconds.
i cried and covered my mouth.
Awful.
Wow, I watched through the whole thing, utterly appalling. It is hard to believe this kind of thing can continue to go on. Thankfully though, it would seem something like this is more of an oddity than standard procedure like it was back in the day.
And towards sean’s comment… I wouldn’t ask quite so much why (maybe a big event among their people or something), but at least this atrocity can see the light of day, where hopefully people can learn from such a mistake of humanity.
I have heard this is a way to get rid of widows when the family doesn’t want to feed them anymore. This is how most “witchcraft” accusations begin. It’s truly barbaric.
I have a hard time thinking of the people who are doing this as human.
But then again, our country got caught torturing. Fear and superstition are a deadly combination.
Exodus 22:18 has always been a convenient way to get rid of people who are a little different or a different political/tribal/family group.
I wouldn’t assume that it’s rare. This article
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/dec/09/tracymcveigh.theobserver
indicates that this sort of thing is common.
I am shattered.
I’m fucking speechless.
I kept wondering what must be going on in that poor man’s head as he sits there, resigned to the fire for crimes he didn’t commit.
Where is the justice in this? How can we do this to ourselves?
More importantly, when will this end?
This has less to do with ideology than ignorance, depravity and suffering. Witchcraft is merely an excuse to justify anger and vengeance towards the pitiful conditions into which these people where born. Going to these people, speaking of irrationality and fallacious thinking, would be largely futile. What these people really need is a better standard of living. Then you can start demanding rational thought.
You will not address their rational needs until their nonrational needs are met first
This is just sick and wrong.
I didn’t watch the video though. Out of curiosity, does it specify whether the perpetrators of this were Christians or animists?
It doesn’t specify.
Mike,
I didn’t watch the video either, but the Guardian article that Justin links to above puts the blame squarely on a huge new growth in evangelical Christian churches in Nigeria.
I remember an argument I had with someone on Ebay atheist I think. Their position was IIRC that Christianity would prove a socially calming force within the places in the world it had spread to. He reasoned this because America is mostly Christian, and mostly calm socially.
I argued that this would NOT be the case. Because, I argued, Christianity isn’t the same everywhere in the world. I argued that a strife-torn country where the residents turned to Christianity would be a strife-torn Christian country.
My working understanding was that Christianity by itself (or maybe not at all) is not more responsible for social harmony than education, health care, civil justice etc, and those DO NOT flow automagically from the Bible.
The video has been removed from YouTube. Here’s another link to it elsewhere:
http://www.inewsit.com/video/gallery/Five-people-suspected-to-be-witchcrafts-were-bruterly-murded-in-kisii-Nyamataro-Village
This is the sort of thing that makes the “But if you don’t believe in a God, where do you get your morals from?” argument go from laughable to just sad.
Truly barbaric. But thats humans. Reading histories, I think this is closer to our animal nature than the altruism that most atheists espouse.
To horribly misquote Heinlin, any nation that ‘aint goin to war no more’ is doomed to failure.
I worry that most people who support modern atheism just look at that atrocity and feel ill. Or feel shame. Or feel impotent anger.
I felt the urge to check my arsenal. If anyone tried that kind of insanity near me, I would put a bullet in every one there, or die trying.
We need to do something. Anything.
Stupid fucking broken people.
I wonder if Mrs. Palin knows these folks….she had that witchhunter bless her.
Clearly Rick Warren surely supports these folks too.
Oh no, Warren – Palin 2010?
AAHHHHHHH!!!!
The people standing around, some will disagree with this crap but are forced to watch it, as they would end up on the fire themselves if they stand up to this crap.
You can not argue with irrationality.
Unfortuneatly this is Africa. its all part of the c.ulture. What is needed is a massive push to educate the masses. Then maybe we can see a change in the culture that lets people beleive this sort of thing is true
I find myself uncomfortably numb. Appalling, just appalling.
I wonder where the demons went after they were cast out with the fire. Probably into pigs. Unchecked irrationality mixed with power is a very dangerous thing.
Some of the most well-off and learned people in the world have done this and worse throughout history. What a shame!
I am not going to watch. I can’t stand it. But I will point out that while I certainly don’t think this is acceptable behavior, I can’t other these people. They may live in a “primitive” place- but we are just as violent. Having religious justification doesn’t make it better or worse than for material things or because of a surge of passion. Let’s pull that log out of our own eye….
How do you even attempt to educate people like that? Without getting thrown in too? If I knew, I’d love to give it a shot.
Absolutely stunning.
[...] http://friendlyatheist.com/2009/04/19/burned-at-the-stake-after-being-accused-of-witchcraft/ [...]
If you’re trying to educate them at the same moment that they’re throwing people in the fire, I think it might be too late. You’ve crossed that event horizon.
I think these incidents begin to make Sam Harris’ case for him. That yes, the seeds for the problem are in the holy book, the holy book excuses the problem. As Jeff says above, even Jesus personally performs exorcisms in the Bible.
The very notion of “demons” has but one purpose socially… and that’s as a tool to set another human being to a status below that of the rest of humanity. To demonize someone is to literally define them below the threshold of human existence, and therefore outside of the protections we grant our fellow peaceable neighbors.
For years I thought Sam Harris was far off the mark blaming moderates for enabling the work of extremists. I still think he puts his case badly.
But I am beginning to think that there is a case to be made here. Feeding irrationality with more irrationality is like giving a man dying of thirst rum instead of water.
“Unfortuneatly this is Africa. its all part of the c.ulture. What is needed is a massive push to educate the masses. Then maybe we can see a change in the culture that lets people beleive this sort of thing is true”
This is bordering on racist, if not crossing over. Are you aware that Africa is a huge continent that has many self-governing countries? You can’t say something is the “culture” of an entire continent.
“This is bordering on racist, if not crossing over”
First, if your going to call someone a racist put your name beghind the accusation.
Second, pick up a cultural geography book (or just watch the news) and see this type of belief spans numerous countries in Africa.
Nothing racist about it.
[...] I’ve been trying to process the horror that Hemant Mehta shared on Friendly Atheist: the burning alive of suspected witches in Kenya. (please, please don’t watch the video unless you are willing to weep, and throw up, and feel [...]
Didnt catch the “edit”
While internet sites (except this one of course)can be misleading, I found this interesting in regards to the above.
http://www.culturekitchen.com/leo_igwe/story/witchcraft_in_africa
I watched the whole thing and can’t believe the fucking cruelty of the people who would do something like this. What kind of bullshit must one believe in to commit such a horrendous act on another human being?
“With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.” – Steven Weinberg
Well, the discussion surrounding this video here certainly fosters an us v them mentality b/w the ‘rational’ athiest and the immoral believer (in deed often equating, unapologetically, all moderate theists with the actions of this group of people). The idea that tribal cultural/religious practices and, say, Quakerism or the Buddhist notion of nirvana could be lumped together and judged categorically is as irrational as anything you all would attribute to these ‘dims’. There are real problems, inequalities, and violent institutions in the world which transcend atheism/theism debates. Hopefully we can one day over come such hang-ups in order to one day live in a world that truly embraces diversity rather than enforcing ever-newfangled normativity.
Peace!
This is truly sick and is why we need to encourage people to see the reality of their religious beliefs and the serious damage and harm they are responsible for.
Bubba,
As long as the newfangled normativity is an improvement on literally burning people at the stake, I’ll take that over “diversity” any day of the week.
If you gloss over the part where people are murdering each other over religion, then yeah, we look like a bunch of intolerant assholes. Silly us, caring about human rights!
You intone disapproval, but I am having a hard time understanding your exact point. Are you really coming here to wag your finger at us dirty atheists for shamefully disapproving of witch hunts and asserting that irrationality is at least partially to blame?
Agreed. But religion is a power multiplier and a radicalizing force in these same problem areas. What say we work on taking away the accelerant factor religion has on violence?
I propose we stop hoping and start working to overcome irrationality.
Yesterday I watched the first 30 seconds of this video, and now I still feel sick. Apparently, LiveLeak is the new Ogrish.
I’ve seen quite a bit of gore in my day – used to work ER at a Level 1 trauma center. It doesn’t compare to that video. Absolutely disgusting. Made me nauseous.
[...] for their body parts). Those of you of a strong constitution may want to see the horrific and distressing footage of witch-burning in Africa posted on Hemant Metha’s Friendly Atheist site but I warn you it is probably the worst thing you [...]
I really wish I could say this is the worst thing I have ever seen, but it is beaten (if that’s even the right word for it) by a man having his throat cut by Muslim terrorists before his head was fully decapitated.
I also wish I had never watched either of these as they haunt my dreams.
Something just has to be done about this. It is incredible that anyone would have to go through this for a crime they didn’t even commit.
[...] http://friendlyatheist.com/2009/04/19/burned-at-the-stake-after-being-accused-of-witchcraft/ Comparta: [...]
Jesus Christ. This is the most terrible thing I have ever watched in my life time. These fricking criminals should be traced, arrested and taken to the Internation Criminal tribunal for crime against humanity. This is murder short and simple. How the hell are they going to sleep after commiting such a terrible crime? This is unbelievable. This cannot be happening in Africa. GOD BLESS AND FORGIVE OUR SINS AND TRANSGRESSIONS FOR WE DO NOT KNOW WHAT WE ARE DOING.
Ok, here is a problem. Why do we have to give money to poor stupid people like that!
Heres the deal, bomb them and biult a new land.
I hate it when i see such cruelty and my only answear to this is to go in the village swipe them out and open a a Mcdonalds and big malls!
Who the hell needs people like this!
Oh my goodness. That’s completely unacceptable. If you don’t agree with what someone else believes then you look the other way. You don’t burn them alive.
People are so cruel.
just repulsively horrifying.
some perspective: one has to wonder, given the size of the crowd, if the victims themselves were never on the other side of the blows and branches when they were young and able and mad with the same ignorance and superstitions.
this occurred to me by considering how the non-prophets’ misanthrope-in-residence, shilling, would have responded. i must say, it’s done me some small favor, to think that it could be just desserts. of course if this is the first time this community’s ever burnt anyone alive then my point is moot.
i can not belive this. it was so sad so so so EVIL no other word for it whats this world coming to!
While it is not now as common (but more common that we think) to do this to humans, it is VERY common to commit these atrocities on animals – even in the United States.
this is madness!!!! cant believe ppl r still into these things….
my hasnt the world moved on and improved since the salem witch trials in 1692.NOT!!!
I don’t blame religion for this matter, Who I do blame are individuals who carry out there evil nature to use to their advantage. Religion can be the blame and it is sad that the people will use the bible to justify their own twisted principles.
You really can’t blame religion for this, blame man for this. Man alone is responsible for their own actions. Putting blame on them with religion is far to ignorant.
MAN IS GUILTY, NOT RELIGION WHETHER IT IS TRUE OR NOT. MAN IS THE BLAME NOT SOME FAIRYTALE. JUST BLAME HUMANITY FOR THIS, IT IS HAPPENING IN ALL BELIEFS, NOT JUST FROM THE BIBLE.
You have this happening in ALLLLL relgions, not just christianity and what is in realtions to christianity. It really saddens me when atheists try to use this video as a tool to put down one particualar relgion.
I’m not religoius myself or a christian for that much, but if your going to target christians for this, then I would feel it would be fair to target all religions that use violence with their beliefs.
That is just plain sick. Couldn’t watch the whole thing.
Danny: I must say, this is not what Christianity is truly about. If we read what Christ taught, this is the exact opposite. People are idiots. Plain and simple. Their actions don’t always match up with what they “claim” to follow.
Joshua:
I agree completely. If we are going to use such videos/stories as tools to accuse a certain religion then we should also consider the good that also comes from many Christians and people from other faiths. We have to be fair and view both sides, the good and the bad.
If I can use the above video to “prove” that Christianity is “evil” then I can use the many examples of good to prove that it’s “good.”
kenya is where ayaan hirsi ali is from
being a Witch myself, this makes my stomach turn. and after reading some of the comments below, people saying “It is incredible that anyone would have to go through this for a crime they didn’t even commit.”
Witchcraft is NOT in any shape or form a CRIME. it makes me sick that someone would even think it is.
The world has had 317 goddamn years to realize what these witch burnings have done. have people not researched ANYTHING in 317 years?? do people not know that those witch burning back in Salem were WRONG? that these people were actually practicing a religion that was about worship nature and believing in karma? that these Witches were once looked upon as HEALERS??
absolutely sickening.
The depth of darkness in the human mind is unimaginable
Twice have i seen crimes commited that saddened me this much
1. the lynching of emmit smith(african american)
2. this video with these barbaric kenyans killing each other.
Man left to himself is capable of horrible things.
Humans can be such filth. Torturing people to death… couldn´t watch the video. This should be stopped NOW! Government of that land must be urged to act NOW!
It just goes to show how far ignorance can turn into atrocities.
This kind of execution and brutality was understandable back in the medieval days because they didnt know anything.
But now, doing this just seems so wrong. Religious fanatics can do so much damage in a very conventional world.
Justin
This is awful so sad to watch.
pure evil ba***ds out there.
what is this world coming up to?????
[...] http://friendlyatheist.com/2009/04/19/burned-at-the-stake-after-being-accused-of-witchcraft/ [...]