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	<title>Comments on: Ideas for a Humanist Wedding Ceremony?</title>
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	<description>Atheism with Positivity</description>
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		<title>By: AnonyMouse</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-296620</link>
		<dc:creator>AnonyMouse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Apr 2009 21:12:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-296620</guid>
		<description>For me, the most romantic wedding invocation would begin with &quot;Five billion years ago, a star exploded...&quot;  It would go on to explain how the dust from that star flew through space until it came to our developing planet, where it landed (crashed?) and became a part of the earth.  Over time, the life developing on Earth incorporated that stardust into itself, passing it on from generation to generation, until it reached the happy couple.  Add a bit about uniting two pieces of stardust, and you have a winner.

Of course, it would completely scandalize my young-earth Creationist parents... XD

I would also like to perform a romantic duet with the man I&#039;m marrying, either before the vows or in their place.  The problem with weddings, in my opinion, is that there&#039;s too much talking and not enough singing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For me, the most romantic wedding invocation would begin with &#8220;Five billion years ago, a star exploded&#8230;&#8221;  It would go on to explain how the dust from that star flew through space until it came to our developing planet, where it landed (crashed?) and became a part of the earth.  Over time, the life developing on Earth incorporated that stardust into itself, passing it on from generation to generation, until it reached the happy couple.  Add a bit about uniting two pieces of stardust, and you have a winner.</p>
<p>Of course, it would completely scandalize my young-earth Creationist parents&#8230; XD</p>
<p>I would also like to perform a romantic duet with the man I&#8217;m marrying, either before the vows or in their place.  The problem with weddings, in my opinion, is that there&#8217;s too much talking and not enough singing.</p>
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		<title>By: HappyNat</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212691</link>
		<dc:creator>HappyNat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 17:46:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212691</guid>
		<description>Each write your own vows and don&#039;t share them until the wedding, have music you and your wife like played by friends, have the pastor not mention god, keep it short, and get to the party.  It worked for us anyway.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Each write your own vows and don&#8217;t share them until the wedding, have music you and your wife like played by friends, have the pastor not mention god, keep it short, and get to the party.  It worked for us anyway.</p>
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		<title>By: snoozebar</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212367</link>
		<dc:creator>snoozebar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 02:47:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212367</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;That’s great, but some of the more traditional guests can feel unsettled by it. Most people, especially older people, have certain cultural expectations of what a “wedding” is.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Frankly, my older relatives can suck it.  We&#039;re the first grandchildren getting married (on both sides), so they&#039;ll take what they get and like it.   It&#039;s not them getting married anyways.  

They can go drown their disappointments in the free champagne we&#039;re providing them.  :p</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>That’s great, but some of the more traditional guests can feel unsettled by it. Most people, especially older people, have certain cultural expectations of what a “wedding” is.</p></blockquote>
<p>Frankly, my older relatives can suck it.  We&#8217;re the first grandchildren getting married (on both sides), so they&#8217;ll take what they get and like it.   It&#8217;s not them getting married anyways.  </p>
<p>They can go drown their disappointments in the free champagne we&#8217;re providing them.  :p</p>
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		<title>By: Anne</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212123</link>
		<dc:creator>Anne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212123</guid>
		<description>The problem with standard American weddings is that they are very short once you take out the god talk.  I&#039;ve been to one that clocked in at 8 minutes (I overheard a guest saying that it was &quot;baby of all weddings&quot;) and another clocked in at under 5.  That&#039;s great, but some of the more traditional guests can feel unsettled by it.  Most people, especially older people, have certain cultural expectations of what a &quot;wedding&quot; is.  There has to be a guy in a dark suit, a gal in a white dress, a person in front directing things, a series of vows and readings, some rings switching hands, and a cake.  I don&#039;t think any of those things are mandatory myself, but if you don&#039;t go down the list and hit these points, they feel that something is strange, that somehow the magic marriage mojo wasn&#039;t properly invoked.  Even if the substance isn&#039;t religious, hitting those notes will help the traditional folks feel at ease.  I was happy with a courthouse, but my own marriage hit those notes to celebrate with our families.  We even used some bible verses where appropriate - a good quote is a good quote.  For someone who was strongly anti-marriage, Paul&#039;s letter on love is quite nice.  There are some great passages in Song of Solomon about waiting for your beloved.  We even adjourned to the reception with &quot;A man hath no better thing under the sun, than to eat, and to drink, and be merry.&quot; (Ecclesiastes 8: 15)  There was no god talk, no dogma, lots of secular readings, but the inclusion of biblical quotes was appreciated.  This couple is getting married in a church by a priest, and it would be a nice gesture to include some nicer, non-dogmatic bits of the faith of their host and families.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem with standard American weddings is that they are very short once you take out the god talk.  I&#8217;ve been to one that clocked in at 8 minutes (I overheard a guest saying that it was &#8220;baby of all weddings&#8221;) and another clocked in at under 5.  That&#8217;s great, but some of the more traditional guests can feel unsettled by it.  Most people, especially older people, have certain cultural expectations of what a &#8220;wedding&#8221; is.  There has to be a guy in a dark suit, a gal in a white dress, a person in front directing things, a series of vows and readings, some rings switching hands, and a cake.  I don&#8217;t think any of those things are mandatory myself, but if you don&#8217;t go down the list and hit these points, they feel that something is strange, that somehow the magic marriage mojo wasn&#8217;t properly invoked.  Even if the substance isn&#8217;t religious, hitting those notes will help the traditional folks feel at ease.  I was happy with a courthouse, but my own marriage hit those notes to celebrate with our families.  We even used some bible verses where appropriate &#8211; a good quote is a good quote.  For someone who was strongly anti-marriage, Paul&#8217;s letter on love is quite nice.  There are some great passages in Song of Solomon about waiting for your beloved.  We even adjourned to the reception with &#8220;A man hath no better thing under the sun, than to eat, and to drink, and be merry.&#8221; (Ecclesiastes 8: 15)  There was no god talk, no dogma, lots of secular readings, but the inclusion of biblical quotes was appreciated.  This couple is getting married in a church by a priest, and it would be a nice gesture to include some nicer, non-dogmatic bits of the faith of their host and families.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212099</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:34:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212099</guid>
		<description>Some of the most pleasurable weddings I&#039;ve been involved in (I&#039;m a photographer) have been non-religious. They often maintain the basic elements: entrance, officiant says something nice, exchange the rings, kiss, exit. One of the things I&#039;ve liked about it (other than the fact that there&#039;s no god-talk), is that they&#039;ve been quick, and more meaningful &lt;em&gt;because&lt;/em&gt; it&#039;s quick. That is, it&#039;s not about all the drawn out traditional crap; it&#039;s simply about two people getting married. Discard all the religious trappings, do the meaningful bits, keep it moving so the guests don&#039;t fall asleep, and then get on with the eating and partying...which I think is just as meaningful as the ceremony, by the way. For American weddings, anyway, it&#039;s all about everyone getting together and celebrating, eating, drinking and dancing to bad music.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some of the most pleasurable weddings I&#8217;ve been involved in (I&#8217;m a photographer) have been non-religious. They often maintain the basic elements: entrance, officiant says something nice, exchange the rings, kiss, exit. One of the things I&#8217;ve liked about it (other than the fact that there&#8217;s no god-talk), is that they&#8217;ve been quick, and more meaningful <em>because</em> it&#8217;s quick. That is, it&#8217;s not about all the drawn out traditional crap; it&#8217;s simply about two people getting married. Discard all the religious trappings, do the meaningful bits, keep it moving so the guests don&#8217;t fall asleep, and then get on with the eating and partying&#8230;which I think is just as meaningful as the ceremony, by the way. For American weddings, anyway, it&#8217;s all about everyone getting together and celebrating, eating, drinking and dancing to bad music.</p>
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		<title>By: Amber</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212082</link>
		<dc:creator>Amber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:04:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212082</guid>
		<description>&lt;/em&gt;Our wedding was very secular, slightly irreverant, and seemed to not offend my husbands VERY Catholic family.  Some excerpts include:

&lt;em&gt;Author Kathleen Norris said:  “Intimacy is what makes a marriage.  Not a ceremony, not a piece of paper from the state.”  A marriage is more than a wedding.  A wedding ceremony is only a symbol, a public announcement of that which is within:  a union which an officiant makes legal, but which the law can neither create nor destroy.

Marriage represents the ultimate intimacy between two people.  It should be entered into with certainty, with mutual respect, and with a sense of reverence, but also with humor, happiness and joy.  At its heart, a marriage is the promises made and kept by two individuals.  No one can marry you but yourselves, XXXXX and XXXXX, and the promises that you are about to exchange serve as verbal representation of the love and commitment you pledge to each other.&lt;/em&gt;

&lt;em&gt;XXXXX:  XXXXX, you are my best friend and everlasting companion.  You have brought me the truest happiness I have ever known.  Will you accept this ring and be my wife?&lt;/em&gt;

&lt;em&gt;Officiant:  Philosopher Joseph Campbell said:  “We must be willing to get rid of the life we’ve planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us.”  Today, by proclaiming their commitment to each other, and exchanging rings, XXXXX and XXXXX have taken the next step in the life that is waiting for them.  May it be a life filled with happiness, laughter and joy.&lt;/em&gt;

We also included a reading of the poem &quot;I Like You&quot; by Sandol Stoddard Warburg.  

In addition, instead of favors, we made a donation to the Carl Sagan Educational Foundation in memory of my late father-in-law (a scientist and athiest), and placed a note to that effect in our programs.

All in all, our ceremony took a whopping 20 minutes, and we had lots of lovely comments about how &quot;us&quot; it was, even from my devout Catholic in-laws.  I think my husbands elderly Italian aunt who goes to mass every day had the most effusive praise for it!  Go figure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Our wedding was very secular, slightly irreverant, and seemed to not offend my husbands VERY Catholic family.  Some excerpts include:</p>
<p><em>Author Kathleen Norris said:  “Intimacy is what makes a marriage.  Not a ceremony, not a piece of paper from the state.”  A marriage is more than a wedding.  A wedding ceremony is only a symbol, a public announcement of that which is within:  a union which an officiant makes legal, but which the law can neither create nor destroy.</p>
<p>Marriage represents the ultimate intimacy between two people.  It should be entered into with certainty, with mutual respect, and with a sense of reverence, but also with humor, happiness and joy.  At its heart, a marriage is the promises made and kept by two individuals.  No one can marry you but yourselves, XXXXX and XXXXX, and the promises that you are about to exchange serve as verbal representation of the love and commitment you pledge to each other.</em></p>
<p><em>XXXXX:  XXXXX, you are my best friend and everlasting companion.  You have brought me the truest happiness I have ever known.  Will you accept this ring and be my wife?</em></p>
<p><em>Officiant:  Philosopher Joseph Campbell said:  “We must be willing to get rid of the life we’ve planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us.”  Today, by proclaiming their commitment to each other, and exchanging rings, XXXXX and XXXXX have taken the next step in the life that is waiting for them.  May it be a life filled with happiness, laughter and joy.</em></p>
<p>We also included a reading of the poem &#8220;I Like You&#8221; by Sandol Stoddard Warburg.  </p>
<p>In addition, instead of favors, we made a donation to the Carl Sagan Educational Foundation in memory of my late father-in-law (a scientist and athiest), and placed a note to that effect in our programs.</p>
<p>All in all, our ceremony took a whopping 20 minutes, and we had lots of lovely comments about how &#8220;us&#8221; it was, even from my devout Catholic in-laws.  I think my husbands elderly Italian aunt who goes to mass every day had the most effusive praise for it!  Go figure.</p>
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		<title>By: kungfu</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212015</link>
		<dc:creator>kungfu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:17:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212015</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Exactly how is it a compromise when the atheist consents to a religious wedding? Isn’t that like compromising on capital punishment by agreeing to be shot with a smaller caliber bullet?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

At first I fought pretty hard and we were going to have the ceremony outside, but settled on the church because of unpredictable weather, cost, and the number of people that are coming. We have no affiliation with this church and are choosing it just because it looks cool. The benefit is that it&#039;s a Lutheran church, and so that seems to somehow make things more acceptable to her large family even though I make it clear that I&#039;m nonreligious.

The expectation from her family was always a strictly Lutheran wedding at their family&#039;s home church, which often equates to a full service with message and sometimes cannibalism (communion). I would not be going down the path of conversion like others in that family had done.

Yet at the same time, this wedding is about &lt;i&gt;us&lt;/i&gt;, and not about &lt;i&gt;me&lt;/i&gt; waving a flag to point out to everyone that &quot;hey, I&#039;m an atheist!&quot; That&#039;s where the compromise comes in. I don&#039;t want to remember the day as a struggle between our beliefs or nonbeliefs. Hell, I put enough of that in every other day of the week.

We&#039;re trying to find a happy medium that we can both enjoy. She really wants to have some sort of religious song during the ceremony, and I can take that as long as it&#039;s not too... y&#039;know. We&#039;ve talked to the pastor doing the wedding and I&#039;ve made it clear that I want no reference to any gods during my vows, but she doesn&#039;t mind saying them in hers. I&#039;ve told him no sermon and no father/son/holy spirit talk, and that&#039;s ok with my bride. 

I like the ideas I&#039;m getting here because it will give me some fodder to go back and show them specifics about how a wedding doesn&#039;t have to be religious. Religious weddings are really all they or I know, and it&#039;s hard to think of what else is out there.

Yes, it&#039;s frustrating at times because I hate to feel like I&#039;m giving the wrong impression of being religious. But this isn&#039;t a day for me to trumpet to the world that I don&#039;t believe in what you believe in. It&#039;s a day of celebrating our commitment to each other. Not a day to proselytize, on either side of the fence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Exactly how is it a compromise when the atheist consents to a religious wedding? Isn’t that like compromising on capital punishment by agreeing to be shot with a smaller caliber bullet?</p></blockquote>
<p>At first I fought pretty hard and we were going to have the ceremony outside, but settled on the church because of unpredictable weather, cost, and the number of people that are coming. We have no affiliation with this church and are choosing it just because it looks cool. The benefit is that it&#8217;s a Lutheran church, and so that seems to somehow make things more acceptable to her large family even though I make it clear that I&#8217;m nonreligious.</p>
<p>The expectation from her family was always a strictly Lutheran wedding at their family&#8217;s home church, which often equates to a full service with message and sometimes cannibalism (communion). I would not be going down the path of conversion like others in that family had done.</p>
<p>Yet at the same time, this wedding is about <i>us</i>, and not about <i>me</i> waving a flag to point out to everyone that &#8220;hey, I&#8217;m an atheist!&#8221; That&#8217;s where the compromise comes in. I don&#8217;t want to remember the day as a struggle between our beliefs or nonbeliefs. Hell, I put enough of that in every other day of the week.</p>
<p>We&#8217;re trying to find a happy medium that we can both enjoy. She really wants to have some sort of religious song during the ceremony, and I can take that as long as it&#8217;s not too&#8230; y&#8217;know. We&#8217;ve talked to the pastor doing the wedding and I&#8217;ve made it clear that I want no reference to any gods during my vows, but she doesn&#8217;t mind saying them in hers. I&#8217;ve told him no sermon and no father/son/holy spirit talk, and that&#8217;s ok with my bride. </p>
<p>I like the ideas I&#8217;m getting here because it will give me some fodder to go back and show them specifics about how a wedding doesn&#8217;t have to be religious. Religious weddings are really all they or I know, and it&#8217;s hard to think of what else is out there.</p>
<p>Yes, it&#8217;s frustrating at times because I hate to feel like I&#8217;m giving the wrong impression of being religious. But this isn&#8217;t a day for me to trumpet to the world that I don&#8217;t believe in what you believe in. It&#8217;s a day of celebrating our commitment to each other. Not a day to proselytize, on either side of the fence.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Blumberg</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212011</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Blumberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 15:16:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212011</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s a poem by Shaneegh Pugh, a Welsh poet, that I admire much. &lt;a href=&quot;http://sheenagh.googlepages.com/thedreadedsometimes&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;She&#039;s pretty much repudiated it&lt;/a&gt;, because it&#039;s been so over-quoted (and misquoted), but it&#039;s still fine; it&#039;s called &quot;Sometimes&quot;:

&lt;em&gt;Sometimes things don&#039;t go, after all,
From bad to worse. Some years, muscadel
Faces down frost; green thrives; the crops don&#039;t fail,
Sometimes a man aims high, and all goes well.

A people sometimes will step back from war;
Elect an honest man; decide they care
Enough, that they can&#039;t leave some stranger poor.
Some men become what they are born for.

Sometimes our best efforts do not go
Amiss; sometimes we do as we meant to.
The sun will sometimes melt a field of sorrow
That seemed hard frozen: may it happen for you.&lt;/em&gt;

I think it would make a lovely wedding poem.

With regard,

Richard</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s a poem by Shaneegh Pugh, a Welsh poet, that I admire much. <a href="http://sheenagh.googlepages.com/thedreadedsometimes" rel="nofollow">She&#8217;s pretty much repudiated it</a>, because it&#8217;s been so over-quoted (and misquoted), but it&#8217;s still fine; it&#8217;s called &#8220;Sometimes&#8221;:</p>
<p><em>Sometimes things don&#8217;t go, after all,<br />
From bad to worse. Some years, muscadel<br />
Faces down frost; green thrives; the crops don&#8217;t fail,<br />
Sometimes a man aims high, and all goes well.</p>
<p>A people sometimes will step back from war;<br />
Elect an honest man; decide they care<br />
Enough, that they can&#8217;t leave some stranger poor.<br />
Some men become what they are born for.</p>
<p>Sometimes our best efforts do not go<br />
Amiss; sometimes we do as we meant to.<br />
The sun will sometimes melt a field of sorrow<br />
That seemed hard frozen: may it happen for you.</em></p>
<p>I think it would make a lovely wedding poem.</p>
<p>With regard,</p>
<p>Richard</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah T.</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-212000</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah T.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:52:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-212000</guid>
		<description>I had a completely civil ceremony that was very meaningful to us and to our friends and family, even the religious ones. I&#039;m uncomfortable posting the whole thing here, but the general plan was:

Welcome and recognition of the role of parents
Readings (5 in all, mostly short poems with one longer performance)
Officiant Speechifies (he read a section of the Massachusettes ruling on civil marriages, which was a huge hit)
Vows and ring exchange (we wrote our own)
Kiss the bride!

Please feel free to email me for a full copy of the ceremony and a list of readings, if you&#039;d like. There are so many amazing poems out there that are suitable in place of Bible verses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had a completely civil ceremony that was very meaningful to us and to our friends and family, even the religious ones. I&#8217;m uncomfortable posting the whole thing here, but the general plan was:</p>
<p>Welcome and recognition of the role of parents<br />
Readings (5 in all, mostly short poems with one longer performance)<br />
Officiant Speechifies (he read a section of the Massachusettes ruling on civil marriages, which was a huge hit)<br />
Vows and ring exchange (we wrote our own)<br />
Kiss the bride!</p>
<p>Please feel free to email me for a full copy of the ceremony and a list of readings, if you&#8217;d like. There are so many amazing poems out there that are suitable in place of Bible verses.</p>
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		<title>By: Perfect Fool</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/comment-page-1/#comment-211980</link>
		<dc:creator>Perfect Fool</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 14:21:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/07/29/ideas-for-a-humanist-wedding-ceremony/#comment-211980</guid>
		<description>Exactly how is it a compromise when the atheist  consents to a religious wedding? Isn&#039;t that like compromising on capital punishment by agreeing to be shot with a smaller caliber bullet?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exactly how is it a compromise when the atheist  consents to a religious wedding? Isn&#8217;t that like compromising on capital punishment by agreeing to be shot with a smaller caliber bullet?</p>
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