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	<title>Comments on: Hypocrisy in the Catholic Church</title>
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	<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/</link>
	<description>Atheism with Positivity</description>
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		<title>By: Brian E</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179893</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian E</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 14:53:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179893</guid>
		<description>I remember being in summer bible camp in about 8th grade, and me and another kid were screwing around all week (oogling the ladies, spying on their dorms and locker rooms, up late making a ruckus).  Finally one day an angry minister pulled us aside and yelled at us &#039;Where is Christ in your lives?!&#039;

I look back now and giggle, thinking this priest and nun, as well as lots of other priests, could be asked this same thing.  I&#039;ve always been told that one Jesus is in your heart and your life, your life will be transformed.  Not that it means you will no longer feel the urge to sin, but certainly you&#039;d expect Jesus to nudge you in the right direction.  This doesn&#039;t seem to be the case in the least (no surprise there).  Any priest, who supposedly is very sure of their faith, that would risk molesting children knowing the consequences would have to be insane.  And I don&#039;t think all these priests are insane, so how do they justify the risk knowing the consequences, short of they no longer buy into their belief?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember being in summer bible camp in about 8th grade, and me and another kid were screwing around all week (oogling the ladies, spying on their dorms and locker rooms, up late making a ruckus).  Finally one day an angry minister pulled us aside and yelled at us &#8216;Where is Christ in your lives?!&#8217;</p>
<p>I look back now and giggle, thinking this priest and nun, as well as lots of other priests, could be asked this same thing.  I&#8217;ve always been told that one Jesus is in your heart and your life, your life will be transformed.  Not that it means you will no longer feel the urge to sin, but certainly you&#8217;d expect Jesus to nudge you in the right direction.  This doesn&#8217;t seem to be the case in the least (no surprise there).  Any priest, who supposedly is very sure of their faith, that would risk molesting children knowing the consequences would have to be insane.  And I don&#8217;t think all these priests are insane, so how do they justify the risk knowing the consequences, short of they no longer buy into their belief?</p>
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		<title>By: stogoe</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179853</link>
		<dc:creator>stogoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 13:52:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179853</guid>
		<description>I certainly see an organization where the leaders can&#039;t or won&#039;t follow their own prescribed moral strictures as one that deserves more skepticism and scrutiny than they are currently getting.

If the highest mortal authorities can&#039;t even hold themselves to their higher standard, of what worth is this standard at all?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I certainly see an organization where the leaders can&#8217;t or won&#8217;t follow their own prescribed moral strictures as one that deserves more skepticism and scrutiny than they are currently getting.</p>
<p>If the highest mortal authorities can&#8217;t even hold themselves to their higher standard, of what worth is this standard at all?</p>
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		<title>By: blackskeptic</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179638</link>
		<dc:creator>blackskeptic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 06:07:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179638</guid>
		<description>Do you really think that seeing two clergy people kissing is &quot;plenty of reason to doubt.&quot; I think Christians follow god, not man (or so I&#039;ve heard over and over ...) So I doubt that this incident would make them want to quit religion/god. But of course they often put certain clergy people on a pedestal, while claiming that they follow god not man.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you really think that seeing two clergy people kissing is &#8220;plenty of reason to doubt.&#8221; I think Christians follow god, not man (or so I&#8217;ve heard over and over &#8230;) So I doubt that this incident would make them want to quit religion/god. But of course they often put certain clergy people on a pedestal, while claiming that they follow god not man.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Hoffman</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179550</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Hoffman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 01:57:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179550</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Certain as in “not specified”, certain as in “true”, or certain as in “having confidence in one’s opinion”?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Certain as in &quot;particular&quot;.

&lt;blockquote&gt;To me this is simply evidence that the Catholic Church needs to change its own rules and allow priests and nuns to marry&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I&#039;d like to point out, for the record, that in the New Testament church, there is no office of priest or nun. Both are man made, and their celibacy is a man made rule. And the only church offices prescribed in the Bible for the New Testament church, elder and deacon, have specific spousal requirements (1 Timothy 3). There is a difference between rules that institutions make, and what the word of God actually prescribes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Certain as in “not specified”, certain as in “true”, or certain as in “having confidence in one’s opinion”?</p></blockquote>
<p>Certain as in &#8220;particular&#8221;.</p>
<blockquote><p>To me this is simply evidence that the Catholic Church needs to change its own rules and allow priests and nuns to marry</p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;d like to point out, for the record, that in the New Testament church, there is no office of priest or nun. Both are man made, and their celibacy is a man made rule. And the only church offices prescribed in the Bible for the New Testament church, elder and deacon, have specific spousal requirements (1 Timothy 3). There is a difference between rules that institutions make, and what the word of God actually prescribes.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179479</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 23:29:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179479</guid>
		<description>To me this is simply evidence that the Catholic Church needs to change its own rules and allow priests and nuns to marry (and yes, fornicate) just like everybody else.   For God&#039;s sake, they are human.  Let them be human.  I bet that if there was actually a historic Jesus, that he too &quot;got a little&quot; action along the way.  Most charismatic people do.... from all ages.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To me this is simply evidence that the Catholic Church needs to change its own rules and allow priests and nuns to marry (and yes, fornicate) just like everybody else.   For God&#8217;s sake, they are human.  Let them be human.  I bet that if there was actually a historic Jesus, that he too &#8220;got a little&#8221; action along the way.  Most charismatic people do&#8230;. from all ages.</p>
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		<title>By: Slut</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179439</link>
		<dc:creator>Slut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 22:35:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179439</guid>
		<description>This type of thing would have had little or no effect on my own belief. It&#039;s really irrelevant that individuals in any given church are likely to engage in human activities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This type of thing would have had little or no effect on my own belief. It&#8217;s really irrelevant that individuals in any given church are likely to engage in human activities.</p>
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		<title>By: EKM</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179409</link>
		<dc:creator>EKM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 21:47:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179409</guid>
		<description>Daniel Hoffman said,

&lt;blockquote&gt;Because knowing certain facts are not the only determining factor of actions.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Certain as in &quot;not specified&quot;, certain as in &quot;true&quot;, or certain as in &quot;having confidence in one&#039;s opinion&quot;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daniel Hoffman said,</p>
<blockquote><p>Because knowing certain facts are not the only determining factor of actions.</p></blockquote>
<p>Certain as in &#8220;not specified&#8221;, certain as in &#8220;true&#8221;, or certain as in &#8220;having confidence in one&#8217;s opinion&#8221;?</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Hoffman</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179408</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Hoffman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 21:44:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179408</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I call BS. Religion claims it has the truth. If they know there is a God, why would they ever sin?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Because knowing certain facts are not the only determining factor of actions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I call BS. Religion claims it has the truth. If they know there is a God, why would they ever sin?</p></blockquote>
<p>Because knowing certain facts are not the only determining factor of actions.</p>
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		<title>By: Wes</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179407</link>
		<dc:creator>Wes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 21:43:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179407</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;It’s a short read written by someone who is still faithful, despite his finding &lt;b&gt;plenty of reason to doubt&lt;/b&gt;.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I strongly disagree that seeing your priest getting some is &quot;plenty of reason to doubt&quot;. It&#039;s easy to see that the actions of one individual don&#039;t necessarily reflect on the whole. This could serve as a minor moment of doubt, or as a spring board to more serious doubts, but by itself it&#039;s not much.

I can think of numerous actually serious reasons to doubt religion, but from the article there&#039;s no indication that George Saunders considered these. In fact, as the article portrays it, it seems like his faith was only very temporarily shaken, and he didn&#039;t pursue his doubt further, and his skepticism went no further than realizing priests and nuns weren&#039;t infallible. In his article he expresses more skepticism over which nun it was than over whether Jesus exists. 

If this episode is the closest he&#039;s come to doubting his beliefs, then I see no reason to praise him. It certainly doesn&#039;t seem like he reached the &quot;plenty of reason to doubt&quot; stage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>It’s a short read written by someone who is still faithful, despite his finding <b>plenty of reason to doubt</b>.</p></blockquote>
<p>I strongly disagree that seeing your priest getting some is &#8220;plenty of reason to doubt&#8221;. It&#8217;s easy to see that the actions of one individual don&#8217;t necessarily reflect on the whole. This could serve as a minor moment of doubt, or as a spring board to more serious doubts, but by itself it&#8217;s not much.</p>
<p>I can think of numerous actually serious reasons to doubt religion, but from the article there&#8217;s no indication that George Saunders considered these. In fact, as the article portrays it, it seems like his faith was only very temporarily shaken, and he didn&#8217;t pursue his doubt further, and his skepticism went no further than realizing priests and nuns weren&#8217;t infallible. In his article he expresses more skepticism over which nun it was than over whether Jesus exists. </p>
<p>If this episode is the closest he&#8217;s come to doubting his beliefs, then I see no reason to praise him. It certainly doesn&#8217;t seem like he reached the &#8220;plenty of reason to doubt&#8221; stage.</p>
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		<title>By: EKM</title>
		<link>http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/comment-page-1/#comment-179401</link>
		<dc:creator>EKM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 21:35:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/06/04/hypocrisy-in-the-catholic-church/#comment-179401</guid>
		<description>David D.G. said,

&lt;blockquote&gt;The hypocrisy of specific individuals proves only their own profession of morality to be a sham, not that of the institution of which they were a part&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I call BS. Religion claims it has the truth. If they know there is a God, why would they ever sin?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David D.G. said,</p>
<blockquote><p>The hypocrisy of specific individuals proves only their own profession of morality to be a sham, not that of the institution of which they were a part</p></blockquote>
<p>I call BS. Religion claims it has the truth. If they know there is a God, why would they ever sin?</p>
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